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January 22, 2008

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I would also recommend Mr. Chalmers book "Nemesis". What is amazing about our current economic situation is that the "family values" folks have little or nothing to say about our military spending and what effects it will have on their children's and grand children's economic well being, or lack thereof. Blessed are the children, for they shall inherit the national debt.

I would also recommend Mr. Chalmers book "Nemesis". What is amazing about our current economic situation is that the "family values" folks have little or nothing to say about our military spending and what effects it will have on their children's and grand children's economic well being, or lack thereof. Blessed are the children, for they shall inherit the national debt.

Let me get this straight: The government that is supposedly so wasteful of a spender when buying a military, will suddenly become the model of apolitical prudence when:

"...trillions spent on them could have been used to solve the problems of social security and health care, quality education and access to higher education for all, not to speak of the retention of highly skilled jobs within the American economy."

Color me skeptical.

This is nonsense. I remember Eisenhower's 18 January 1961 speech in which he mentioned the military-industrial complex. I'm that old. Why is this nonsense? In the 1960s we spent about 10% of GDP on defense. Now it's 3.6%. Does this ignoramus really believe Chinese and Russian military expenditure claims? My estimates of Russian and Chinese military expenditures are about triple the official fkigures. What a fool! In the 1960s we had 3.2 million men in the military with 179 million Americans. Now we have 1.5 million with 302 million Americans. What is bankrupting the US is: welfare, welfare, welfare. We have an Education Department? Why? We have a $53 trillion social security and medicaid actuarial deficit, etc. etc. Does anyone remember the War on Powerty which began under Lyndon Johnson? What does this ingoramus author think the Chinese are doing with their submarine fleet? I could go on and on. Who provides medical care, schooling, etc, for our 12-15 million illegal aliens and their children? Enough. Our miliary spending is too low. Way too low.

Brian:

Are you suggesting ("The government that is SUPPOSEDLY so wasteful a spender when buying a military...") the military does NOT waste tax payer dollars?

I would suggest that a LOWERING of our taxes by eliminating 60% of this WASTEFUL, UNNECESSARY Defense spending would free up local governments and their citizens to spend it on education, health care, etc.

Or, are you suggesting it is just Americans too stupid to provide the basic services for their citizens?

Not quite certain what you mean, no one wants to give the savings to the lobbyist's to spend through their paid-for D.C. whores. We'll keep it ourselves to pay our bills, thank you very much.

The PERCEPTION we need a huge military is a false one, Brian.

Unless it saved us on 9/11/01? Did it?

Independent Accountant:

Please provide your ultra-secret accounting numbers of the Chinese Defense spending for us all to peruse ("My estimates of Russian and Chinese military expenditures are about triple the official fkigures."), so we can be as informed as you are, please.

And, since you feel our defense spending is "...too low. Way too low.", we will be happy to collect additional taxes from YOU to send on to those frugal budgeteers at the Pentagon.

As someone that worked a decade at a major defense contractor in San Jose, I can tell ya, I'll be happy to debate this issue with you anytime, anywhere.

You seem to be a "bit vague" on HOW you will FUND more defense spending at a time we are NINE TRILLION in debt and GROWING. While the Chinese decline to purchase any more toxic investments from us, and are quietly dumping the trillion or so in reserves they are holding.

You want more debt. Then YOU pay for it.

I want diplomacy with our competitors. What, you think China wants to what? Invade it's prime customer? Bwahahahaha, do you look in your closet and under your bed before you go to sleepie???

Perhaps, just perhaps if the LIARS and Thieves weren't in charge, we wouldn't be burning a BILLION+ a DAY in Iraq, with NO ROI except increasing animosity for illegal and immoral invasion/occupation. I guess the Pentagon has found a way to GROW it's own opposition, and THAT is about ALL it is competent to perform.

Get a clue, this ain't Faux News here buddy.

I'll win. You'll go broke (have gone broke.)

Brian
I think your emotions are in control not your intellect,by the way I remember president Roosevelt speeches (I AM THAT OLD)

Should we also see how the figures for the major countries stack up in terms of purchasing power parity, actual numbers of men under arms, tanks, planes etc?

I'd like to know why discussions of military spending never start with talking about the troops in the other part of the world, like Japan, Korea, Yugoslavia, Germany. We do still have bases and troops in all of those. If we were to start cutting somewhere, I'd say that would be a pretty good place to start.

It's also easy in hindsight to say we should have done this or that. It's easy for us now to forget that the world went through two wars with Germany in pretty short order. A lot of that spending went to make sure that we wouldn't have to deal with yet another world war. I'd say that we were pretty successful with that part. And I'd agree with the posters about the figures for Russia and China. If there are hidden costs in our figures, there are bound to be a lot more in closed societies like those.

Independent Accountant:

Did you even read the article?

If indeed we're pouring $1.1 trillion down the sink hole of "defense" in a year, then that is nearly 10% of the $12 trillion national product ($13 trillion sans borrowings, which don't count as "product" in any real world I've heard of).

But do you honestly buy the government "headline" propaganda economic statistics?

If the GDP (national product) were to be properly deflated by the accumulated mis-reporting of inflation since 1980, it would probably be no more than about $7 trillion. That would make defense spending almost 16% of the national product.

By the way, that's an INCOME to PRODUCT comparison, which is oranges to apples and makes the ratio appear quite low. Each dollar is counted MULTIPLE times in a national product computation, so the actual size of the war spending sector relative to the entire economy could easily be 30 or 40%. Maybe more.

My background is in computers and math and I can assure you there is little opportunity left in those fields outside the defense industry. At least, not in this country. As someone who refused to "go there" a few years ago when looking for a job, that left me with few options -- and relatively low pay (defense contracting pays very well, of course, as it enjoys the the political patronage dynamics and lack of auditing discussed in the article. Which you didn't read.)

I am tired of people who will be dead soon supporting this rapacious complex, which my generation will have to pay for.

Aaron,
I'm surprised by your comments, since I know your someone that understands how the world’s central Banks control economies with the money supply (M1, M2, M3,). The Pentagon is just another mechanism by which the government injects liquidity (inflation) into the economic system. And taxes and/or debt (bonds) are how they neutralize the inflation (sterilize). There is a real problem here in the international community is buying up most of these bonds and not we Americans. Hence, undoing the work of our central bank.
The real problem is we have a government that assumes markets know best and leave the hen house unguarded. And 99% of the other countries out there practice economic manipulation on a massive scale. Fly to Narita Japan sometime, its easy to convert Dollars into Yen at the airport, it’s a different story converting it back the other way.
Most countries in the world do not practice Free Trade and probably never will. As for sources of inflation in the world, look for who is sitting on stockpiles of our bonds. The fantastic economic growth in China, and India, is due to their central bank printing money at warp factor speeds. In China there money supply is growing by 6% to 9% per month and inflation is accelerating. In India people are melting down Rupees for the steel, the steel is worth more than there currency.
Interest rates in Japan are at 0.5% because is devalues the Yen for their exports. That interest rate doesn’t help the Japanese; they simply borrow in Yen, convert it and invest in other countries with it. Hence, a source of international inflation. The Chinese buying up MBS (Mortgage Backed Securities) accomplished the same thing. It devalues the Yuan and gives us more credit to keep on spending.

We are at a turning point. It is time for the rest of these countries to become consumers and we’ll be providers. The Value of our currency is a reflection of our credit worthiness. As long as the international community continues to be obstinate, our economic system will continue to be dysfunctional and the Dollar will fall. Eventually products produced here will be cheap and they (other countries) can cash in those IOU’s (Bonds).

You see, when it comes to Currency, Bonds, Stocks, Real Estate, etc, it is really relative. What is the intrinsic value of something at any point in time? Its like every time I hear someone pontificating about the problems with Social Security. There is no problem with the solvency of Social Security, the government prints all the currency it needs. The real problem is inflation and the government only has two ways of neutralizing it, taxes and debt (bonds). And allot of governments out there are more than willing too undo those actions, and probably never will buy our goods and services.

Note: That pile of $850B of T-Bills the Central Bank of Japan is sitting on is mostly 10-year notes. Over 70% of those notes stopped paying interest years ago.

Dan,

I'm not really seeing the contradiction between my points and yours. The government not only spends vast amounts of money on militarism; it creates some of that money out of thin air. Granted.

And I was in Narita last year, and had no problem converting Yen to Dollars.

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